[00:00:03] Nicholas Zaldastani: In 1988, data was valuable. Today, I would say it’s unbelievably valuable. I mean, private AI models are what really are going to matter in the future. To me, it’s Google on steroids. They’re using our data to build their AI models, which will, in fact, market to us even deeper than they have before.
[00:00:25] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: What’s up gang? This is another episode of Hashing It Out with your boy GhCryptoGuy, Elijah, GhCryptoGuy, you can call me any. This is Cointelegraph’s Hashing It Out, where we hash out the biggest stories in the Web3 space. We are getting to the end of the year, and it’s always nice to do a full year in the Web3 space. The joke that we all tell ourselves is one year in Web3 is like five years in other industries, and what a year it has been so far. We’ll be doing a recap of everything, all the big stories in the year, towards the end. Hopefully, obviously, by then, we should have the US elections out of the way. Let’s see what that does to the market, but also, let’s see what that does to regulations in the USA. And we’ll be talking a bit about regulations in the USA as against other places like Dubai, because my guest for today just came back from Dubai. So, we are going to talk a little bit about that before we get into the conversation about Web3 data infrastructure. Joining me today is Nicholas Zaldastani, who is the chairperson of CESS Network. Hello, Nicholas, and welcome.
[00:01:34] Nicholas Zaldastani: Well, good day, good evening, good afternoon, whatever time it is. And I am the co-founder and chairman of CESS. It is C-E-S-S. I couldn’t be more excited to be with you guys today and talking to you about what’s happening in the world. I did just get back from Dubai, where I spoke at a couple of conferences over there. And three weeks ago, I was in the Congress, the US Congress, and meeting with Republican and Democratic senators as well as congresspeople. So, it’s been very interesting to see the contrast between what I would consider an extremely high-paced adoption of Web3 in the United Emirates, and a little bit of confusion on the part of the Congress of the United States. But I’m very excited to report that the trip I had to Washington, DC, a couple of weeks ago, I saw a real opening of thinking, and when they started seeing especially all the DePIN project success, they were starting to really understand the value of tokenization and more importantly, DePIN overall. So, I hope the movement in the United States goes faster.
To your point about the elections, I’m actually bullish on both sides. Whether the elections go Democrat or Republican, I see some good movement there, but I’m seeing a tremendous amount of movement in Dubai and the United Emirates. We actually went up to another state. Dubai is one, but we went up to RAK, another province, another state of the United Emirates. And again, it’s just unbelievable how much they really see this as an opportunity to get ahead technically. And you know, we all know the blockchain is the next generation of technology. We all know the reason for that is because data sovereignty, privacy and security is absolutely critical. And that’s what the promise of the blockchain and Web3 provides. So, good to be with you today.
[00:03:38] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: Great introduction, and great start. Data sovereignty, privacy are very important to what we are building in the Web3 space, and we are definitely going to delve into that. You mentioned that you were at Oracle before, so let’s do a quick walk down the memory lane. How did you end up in Web3? How did you come from Oracle, end up at CESS? What was that journey like?
[00:04:00] Nicholas Zaldastani: So, the reason I went to Oracle in 1988, I was there when it was less than 500 people. And basically, the reason I went to Oracle was I knew the importance or the value of data. And back then, if someone was building an application, they had two alternatives. They could either write to the local file system, or they could write inside of the Oracle Database Management System. If they wrote to the Oracle Database Management system, their application could be moved from different hardware platforms. And that was a huge advantage. If you wrote it only to one hardware platform, then you were locked into that platform. It was very common in the late ‘80s, early ‘90s that you’d hear an application vendor say, yes, I have an application, and it resides on the HP machine or the Sun machine, or the IBM machine or the PC, but it was not common you would hear people say that we run on all of them. And Oracle’s promise was to create that layer on top of the computer operating system that would allow for applications to be ported from one system to another utilizing the same application.
And as we look at what the real value is here, and we look at the importance of data, as I said to you, I went to Oracle because I knew data was valuable. Well, in 1988, data was valuable. Today, I would say it’s unbelievably valuable. I mean, we all know what’s happening with the IoT data and AI data. I mean, this is increasing the value of data. And then there isn’t a day that goes by that data is not hacked. We hear almost every single day now some system got hacked. And so this incredible increase of data that’s out there married with this real challenge that the existing systems do not provide that security that we need is very much, I would say, the hottest topic out there. And in fact, when I left Oracle, I started a company called Open Horizon. And the goal of our company was to allow data to move from one computer system to another with full data safety, security, privacy. And it was extremely difficult to do back in the ‘90s with the technology we had. TCP/IP networks just had arrived. The web was just starting. In terms of ideas, way ahead of ourselves.
So, you asked about how did CESS begin? Well, it started with this premise. We started in 2019. So, we’re getting to five and a half years now. And our vision was very simple. How do we ensure this data privacy, this data safety, security, sovereignty really focused on the data itself, and that it could basically move anywhere in a system while maintaining that sovereignty, privacy and security. And so, the journey that led me here is that when we read... I’m going to go back to Oracle and what I did with Open Horizon, we were using back then the existing networks. When you read the blockchain white paper, you go, oh my gosh, this truly is the foundation of the future. So, that is the place that we saw as an opportunity to really take advantage of this new technology.
And I want to come back to what I had said about Oracle. Remember, Oracle sort of created this layer between the hardware and the application so that the application could be available on multiple hardware pieces. Well, at CESS, what we did is we took advantage of the blockchain, defined by the blockchain, and created this decentralized data infrastructure. So, it’s much easier to write to our system and then writing to a GPU in the blockchain. You’re writing to us, and as a result, we’re taking care of the data sovereignty, scalability, security. And so, this is the big value proposition we’re providing. And it’s very similar to what I was doing back almost 25 years ago at Oracle, almost 30 years ago, I guess. And so the whole premise here is to really give control to the person that owns data, give people back their control so they can securely manage and share and monetize that in a decentralized ecosystem.
So, that’s how I got here. Couldn’t be more excited. You know, when we started, we knew that it was going to be a major amount of work we had to do. We didn’t want to just come up with something and put it in the market within a year or two. We really wanted to work with this. And the biggest thing I am so excited to announce, and I’m jumping ahead, I know, but I’m really excited about this, is that if you go to cess.network, C-E-S-S dot network, you will be updated. But our latest release, which we call Venus, is actually technically what we’re considering our final release. This is our 14th release. We’ve had over 10,000 nodes on every release. So, we’ve really taken, our community has provided us great feedback. I invite those that don’t know about our community to go to Discord or follow us on X. You’ll hear everything about what we’re doing, and we really took all the feedback we got, and we’ve improved the technology significantly over the past five and a half years. Our goal here is to provide a very advanced, secure, transparent, trust-free enterprise application solution.
[00:09:45] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: Sounds interesting, and I think we’ll definitely delve into community feedback and build in the Web3 space in 2024. But let’s talk about the biggest gaps in data sovereignty and privacy within the storage landscape. What are they, and how is CESS dealing with them?
[00:10:02] Nicholas Zaldastani: So, basically, history repeats itself. This is the third major wave. I was not part of the old Unix application development world back in the early ‘80s, but the client server world in the late ‘80s, early ‘90s, was definitely part of what I was very, very attached to, as well as the whole web implementation or the software-as-a-service world. And in every situation, and this is what is so important, is that you have to recognize that there is a real importance on never losing functionality and only gaining the new functionality that the new infrastructure, the new technology provides for.
So, the gap here is basically one of how do you utilize the blockchain in such a way that you surpass all of the benefits and all of the functionality in the Web2 world and gain that data sovereignty and data privacy. And that is really one of the key aspects of what we wanted to accomplish. We wanted to ensure, again, that focus on the data was critical. And basically, by providing the ability for people to own, maintain their data ownership rather than third parties maintaining that data ownership... I think all of your listeners know that when you store something at a third party, you are exchanging the ease of storing that and the significant cost reduction in exchange for them being able to have ownership of that data. And they basically are licensing it back to you.
So, the key thing here, especially with AI models now being hit, or I should say AI models hitting data, this is a much bigger issue, a much faster issue that’s starting to grow here. And that is, really, can you store any of your data in a central space without giving up third party having access to it? And I’m seeing very little case of that being possible. Maybe they’re not going to see exactly your data, but the derivative art of a learning model driven off of your data is what is a little concerning. So, has now AI is exploding, we’ve recognized the importance of a decentralized storage environment or decentralized system overall to allow for AI to flourish without the data itself being basically accessed, if that makes sense.
So, maybe I’ll go into this because, you know, in terms of how we do this, and this is maybe, it’s kind of new, I want to create an object here. It could be anything, but let’s just have it be a database of your most personal information. All your health records and all of your passwords and all of your bank information. Now, that’s an object that you don’t want to have anyone see or have access to. In the centralized world, we’re just storing that object up in the cloud with some third party. And what the third party is doing with it, I touched on my concerns, but you all and everybody knows, and everyone has their concerns.
The promise of basically Web3 is this will be more secure because it will be decentralized. Well, let’s talk about how that happens. So, this object, first of all, is separated into multiple segments. And so, let’s just divide that into 100 segments. The system immediately does that. And not only does it immediately do that, but it also immediately encrypts each one of those segments. Let’s say there was 100 segments made, now you have 100 encrypted segments. Now, the next thing is we actually replicate those segments three, four, five times. That is definable. The developer has the opportunity, but our default is three times. We find that provides a very good number so that you do not ever lose your information. But so how it works here is we’ve got now those 300 segments that are stored now across 300 nodes.
And in the way we assign the nodes is really important. We provide a random way of assigning the nodes. So, not one node operator could really just hold all 300 nodes because we assign that randomly. So, it goes out to multiple places. So, you can now see there’s 300 pieces all over. And oh, by the way, one of the things we can do, and this is why the example the UAE wanted this in the United States government wants this, is we can actually say, okay, the nodes must reside in a particular geographic location. So, those 300 pieces that I’m talking about would only be in the United States, in nodes in the United States, in the UAE would only be in the UAE type of thing.
So, now, let’s say someone gets incredibly clever, and they find one of those nodes. Well, the first thing they got to do is they got to decrypt that node and the information there. So, they use some AI, and they’re able to decrypt it. Well, they now only have 1/100 of the solution. They would have to basically go out there and find the other 99 pieces, so to speak. And remember, we had 300 of them. And remember, they’re all over the place. They’re all random. So, the likelihood that anyone’s going to find those is the promise of what we’re providing and what the blockchain provides. So, we really make it beyond difficult to be able to find those pieces. Nobody can pull together the original file if they didn’t have all the fragments. And so this is something that’s very critical.
And remember, I was talking about the fact that we have three replications. So, to ensure that disaster relief, that means that even if two-thirds of the fragments were lost, we still can recover it. So, this is a key component, and we’ll get into the technology in a little bit, but we have nodes that actually do nothing but consensus. So, they’re tracking what’s going on. And if a node is down, they immediately replace it. So, that’s why the chance that anything goes below three nodes being active doesn’t happen. But I’ve jumped around a little bit. The gap here I want to go back to is very simple, and that is that when you have a centralized system, data can be reached easier than, of course, when you have a decentralized system. And that’s where we come from. We want to make it easy.
[00:16:51] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: So, data infrastructure in Web3, cloud storage, they are all important for various reasons. And I want people to understand what the use cases are and the broad things that we do in the Web3 space. So, I’m going to take a couple of use cases, and I’m going to let you like explain them on a general scale and then explain how CESS is dealing with those specific use cases differently. So, let’s start with NFTs. What is the role of platforms like CESS when it comes to NFT data storage, and how is CESS changing the landscape, or taking a different approach at NFT data?
[00:17:27] Nicholas Zaldastani: First of all, NFTs can be large, as we all know. So, I started expressing how, just a few minutes ago, we store stuff. You could imagine that large file storage, by segmenting that data across multiple nodes and using that encryption to maintain the security is paramount. I would say NFTs’ security is extraordinarily important, and maintaining that ownership is very important. So, no matter how large the file is, it can be split into multiple segments. And that allows us to easily make sure that that NFT data is decentralized, accessible and secure without any compromise of ownership. And this is, again, one of the most important things, the control of that data, that protection of that data so that it goes only to the people it’s meant to go to, not to other people.
[00:18:22] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: Okay. That’s interesting. Let’s get into another big thing in the Web3 space, which is artificial intelligence. I think you already started touching on that, but let’s delve deeper into how AI is changing the data infrastructure landscape, or how the data infrastructure landscape is changing to adapt to AI.
[00:18:40] Nicholas Zaldastani: My first trip to Dubai, I went to Consensus 2049 in the spring, and I spoke there. I said, what AI is going to do for Web3 is kind of like what email did to the internet. What I mean by that is this: The first real driver of the internet was email. That was in 95, 96, 97. And that really was where everyone goes, oh, I now understand we can pass information around. And it was not just a message. Then we started to make it so we could make attachments and all the other things we use in email today. So, it completely made people very comfortable with this thing called the internet. I believe that AI will do the same thing for Web3, because, in my books, and the way we look at it from CESS’ perspective, is that private AI models are what really are going to matter in the future. Having a general public model that you can access and get an answer from, and have it basically presented in any other, any way you’d like is nice. To me, it’s Google on steroids. But when we start talking about some really amazing case studies, this is the type of stuff that intrigues me the most.
Let’s think about health. Today, we all have some unique health issues. I would say some people have some very unique health issues. It’s not uncommon that someone has an ailment that maybe only 2,000 or 3,000 people in the world have ever had. Or let me just say, a very small amount of people have ever had. Can you picture a day where not the data is shared, but the AI models is shared of every single hospital, every single wellness center is shared in some fashion such that a query can be made, and now you’re really getting to the heart of what is most important, and that is finding the ailment and what solved the problem. And this is the case study that intrigues me tremendously, because today, if we pick two hospitals, they could be across the street from each other. Their technical solutions are not even talking to each other. And even if both of them built an AI model off the data that they have, today, the systems of sharing these AI models are not something that people would really want to do.
So, we offer this privacy and compliance by enabling that encrypted storage and providing the mechanism to control the access to that data. And this is what’s incredibly important, so that only the authorized AI models or the developers can have access to the model itself. The data itself is never touched. And so, if I have my health record at a hospital, I can feel rest assured that my data, my name, and all the things about me are never shared. But the high-level summary of what happened and what my situation was, how that could help someone else, is definitely there.
And so we actually at CESS have built what we call the CESS AI-LINK, which is a Byzantine-robust system that ensures data privacy. This allows for training of AI models in a decentralized network without, as I said earlier, exposing the original data, preserving the confidentiality and the integrity of the sensitive information. And so it’s exciting how smart contracts or how a smart contract is responsible for coordinating the training, integration and delegating the training process to nodes within the CESS network. It really increases the performance and security while reducing the price. And it is this case study that we could extend way beyond just the health arena. It’s anywhere where there’s some data that’s of value to understand, where the learning models themselves will provide that understanding. But just sharing those models on the open market would be rather dangerous, or probably, I would say in a different way, never done. But in a private way, in a very secure way, the way we’ve been discussing this today, you can do that. And that’s really where I see our health future significantly improving.
[00:23:14] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: That sounds really interesting, especially the part on health and how technology like this can improve how we take care of people. And I think it’s very important, based on recent events like pandemics, where we had to innovate to figure out how to come out of these circumstances. You mentioned nodes. Your community has deployed thousands of nodes across the various releases that has happened on the CESS network. What is the node structure? Like I understand you have two different types of nodes. How do they interact, and what roles do they play on the CESS network?
[00:23:49] Nicholas Zaldastani: Thank you. There’s two major nodes that are related to our decentralized storage. One is the consensus node, and one is the storage node. And they are both critical to our decentralized architecture. The consensus nodes, they verify and record transactions within the network. Also responsible for sending challenges to the consensus node to ensure they operate honestly and the security of the user data. While the storage node securely stores fragments and periodically accomplishes challenges. They are both incentivized with tokens for participation and maintaining of system integrity. The consensus node earns rewards for successfully adding a block to the blockchain, which is accepted by other consensus nodes.
Our consensus node mechanism is R²S. It ensures any consensus node has a fair opportunity to be elected as an on-duty consensus node, creating a block and earning a reward. In fact, we’re constantly changing out our consensus nodes, so every six hours there are 11 consensus nodes elected as an on-duty node responsible for creating a block, and there is an algorithm that ensures that these 11 nodes earn relatively equal rewards. The major factor for on-duty node selection is random, and that’s a critical part, I said that earlier, but I’m reinforcing that, to ensure that there is fairness. But each consensus earns credits while they create blocks, which has a small effect on the election.
Now, the consensus node earns rewards when they compete for challenges from the consensus node. There are two challenges. One is proof of user data security and integrity. We call that PoDR2, or squared. The other one is PIOS, which is that storage providers provide idle space available as they claim. So, in essence, we’re rewarding people for being either a consensus node or a storage node. There is multiple incentives to ensure that the network participants are aligned to support the data reliability and security, so I don’t want to go into full details. There’s a lot of details to how the storage node is rewarded and how the consensus node is rewarded in our white paper. But you hopefully are taking away the high-level part of this. And again, the uniqueness of what we’re doing in terms of putting this whole thing together.
[00:26:40] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: So, I’m going to take us back to use cases again, because the era that we live in is very polarized. We’ve seen the polarization of this era through elections in the US, UK, everywhere. There’s the East and West divide, and there are multiple reasons why we are polarized. And one of the biggest issues that has led to the extent of polarization is things like data censorship. How does the creation of Web3 data infrastructure help content creators, help people who are just avid users of social media in dealing with data censorship?
[00:27:19] Nicholas Zaldastani: Let’s start with this. We’ve given up our data. I was screaming from the stage last Friday. We’ve completely given up the value of our data, especially for those that are in the social space. This is all now belongs to companies. They’re using our data to help market to us. They’re using our data to build their AI models, which will, in fact, market to us even deeper than they have before. So, there’s a definite need to change what has happened. When I, in 1995, tried to build a company that would provide that data ownership. I was up against people being offered free technology in exchange for their data. And I think by now, we’ve learned that that was probably not the best direction to take. There’s some data that people just don’t care about, but I would say as we get further along here, people are going to care more and more how that data is being used in marketing to ourselves.
And better yet, as we make a request to, let’s say, a learning model, where did that learning model come from, and where was the data, what data was used to build that learning model, and how bias is that learning model? These are the questions we’re going to start to be asking ourselves. I mean, I’ve already started to notice how some text messages that I’ve received sounds like someone just used a ChatGPT keyboard to create the answer, or basically an AI keyboard of some sort. It’s disconnecting us. On many ways, at least with the existing system where we have a website and we have someone browsing, there’s a direct connection into that website. As we move forward, the intermediary is going to be that learning model, and that learning model is going to be smart to summarize that website. So, now I’m getting that summary of that website or where you were talking upfront about that social person that’s presented some information or has created a blog or has done some type of video report, there’s going to be that summary made, and that’s what I’m going to see now going forward. I’m not going to see that raw data.
And so this whole process is really going to create an interesting landscape for us going forward in terms of what is the truth. And one of the biggest benefits of what we’re doing at CESS is ensuring that the data that was created, we know where it came from. That is a really important piece of how we move forward. In other words, understanding who is putting that data together and ensuring that it is actually that person that created that data for us.
[00:30:17] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: Let’s get into Decentralized Object Storage Service by CESS. How does it work? What are the key features? And what does it mean for the end-user?
[00:30:27] Nicholas Zaldastani: So, CESS has a lot of different things. I’m going to jump into our Decentralized Object Storage Service, we call DeOSS, D-E-O-S-S. What are the key features? I said this a little while ago, location-based storage selection. In other words, we support the ability to store only on specific nodes. And you can create a territory, which is really important, especially for government implementations. You notice I said implementations, not projects. I believe we should stop using the word Web3 projects and start calling them Web3 implementations because that’s, we need to be enterprise-grade. I don’t mean that solutions should only be for the enterprise, but they should be that significant.
But anyway, coming back to DeOSS. So, we have that location selection. That’s a huge piece of this. We have data privacy management and permission layer. This allows data access through key authentication, offers permission classification and private management functions, which provide flexibility and unrestricted privacy controls to both enterprises and individuals. We have massive storage, data storage. So, DeOSS is an HTTP-, API-based tool for storing and retrieving unstructured data and metadata objects, catering to high-frequency dynamic storage requirements and enterprise-level, large-scale storage needs.
I go on with other key features. Millisecond data retrieval. DeOSS has enterprise-level, high-performance data capabilities, supporting users to access the desired data at millisecond-level speeds where pretty much anywhere in the world, allowing users and DApps to enjoy decentralized storage services with the efficiency comparable to a traditional centralized storage system. In other words, we have people that are using CESS to stream video and stream audio. So, we really are equaling all of the benefits of an S2 storage, or I would say, I was saying S3, but Web2 storage system. We have to have that same speed. One of the reasons why we have partnered so closely with Amazon is that they see us as very compatible with the S3 architecture, and that is something we’re very happy about in terms of partnerships, because that allows the Web2 world to integrate with the Web3 world, which is absolutely essential. I mean, as we know, it’s super important that the entire Web3 community interacts, but we also have to realize that we have to, looking back, be compatible with prior technologies like Web2.
In terms of other key features, I’ve talked about the hybrid encryption and the high scalability and customization capabilities. So, this is giving users the benefit of data security and reliability, high scalability, data ownership and control, cost-effectiveness, decentralized ecosystem implementation. So, again, our goal here... And that is part of... I just brought up and what we just talked about is just our DeOSS system. When you go and see the white paper, you’ll see extensively how many different things we’re offering in terms of, as I said, AI-LINK, API access and the details of what you can do in terms of having that replication. All that was baked in right from the beginning. So, it’s all about ensuring that data privacy and regulatory compliance that is so important.
[00:34:09] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: One of the biggest, every time we talk about any corner or sector of the Web3 space, is how that sector would drive adoption. How is the decentralized data storage sector of the Web3 space going to bring more people to the Web3 industry?
[00:34:24] Nicholas Zaldastani: I think that way too often, we cannot just build the field of dreams. In other words, just having a technology, a really great technology, by itself is not enough. We really have to be solving a problem. Now, we’ve spoken a lot on this call about the importance of data sovereignty, data privacy and data security, and let’s reinforce that. This is what’s really the most important problem to be solving in the Web3 space is that we really ensure that data value. This is why we built CESS, to provide data value, to have a data value network, in essence. Everything else is inherited from prior technology. In other words, you can’t just say we’re a data value network, or you can’t just say we have a system that provides data sovereignty and privacy and security, if it does not provide all the things we already have in the existing technical world. And so, we have brought all the benefits of the past forward, the interoperability with the past, like our links to Amazon S3, as I mentioned, and most importantly, that real focus on ensuring that data is controlled by the person that creates it.
And this is something that we can take another step at this, because when you start looking at the world from a data-centric standpoint, you can start to think about things and in terms of applications that are going to come along that are just completely so much more advanced, so much more effective than we’ve had before. Let’s just look at what’s happened over the past 20 years, think about all the applications that we now have today, because our phones are, in essence, a client to an application. While the future has to do with not just the client, the phone having that access, but ensuring that the data is completely protected and the value of that data is maintained by the owner of that data.
[00:36:31] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: What are the biggest challenges building a product like CESS in Web3, and what does the future look like for decentralized data storage and projects like CESS?
[00:36:42] Nicholas Zaldastani: It’s always fun foreseeing the problems of the future. Due to the nature of the blockchain technology, the consensus of the network is important, and the process of reaching the consensus always affects the efficiency of the entire network. As more consensus nodes require a longer time to reach consensus, so pioneers are trying their best to improve it. But there is a trade-off between decentralization and efficiency. For example, Bitcoin lets any node become a consensus node, and the competition between them reduces the efficiency of the network. That whole thing reduces the efficiency of the network will ensure that decentralization. Some other projects tried to reduce the number of consensus nodes, and others have set up centralized consensus nodes to ensure that high efficiency. But then, the degree of decentralization decreases.
At CESS, our team really tried to focus on our best balance, these two sides. And our, we call R²S, mechanism ensures each era has only 11 nodes to work out the consensus to achieve relatively high efficiency, while ensuring each node can be elected as an on-duty node to ensure high decentralization. Managing a decentralized storage network requires robust solutions to handle massive data volume, efficiency, and to ensure the platform remains scalable for the enterprise and the Web3 applications alike. CESS is continuously optimizing its network protocol. This enables dynamic load balancing to reduce network congestion, and this setup helps maintain high throughput and low latency as the user base grows. And so, we are thinking ahead. But this challenge that I mentioned to you up front, this balancing, is absolutely the greatest challenge, I feel, that we have with the blockchain. And what’s exciting is every single month that goes by, as we grow, we are constantly refining that balance, and it’s getting better and better and better. That is a key part of what we have done to ensure that data sovereignty, privacy and security.
[00:39:23] Elisha Owusu Akyaw: Interesting months and days ahead as more projects like CESS build the Web3 data infrastructure. Thank you very much, Nicholas, for joining me on Hashing It Out, and I look forward to speaking to you in the future.
[00:39:36] Nicholas Zaldastani: Thank you for your time, and really enjoyed this.
.png)
